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Thread: Probability of coincidence ?

  1. #31
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    Re: Probability of coincidence ?




    @RobAbility!


    Frankly, I did not understand what you were asking about. Can you explain more precisely the connection between some numbers and words?

    Also, what event (or combination of events) is it that you want to calculate the probability for?

    @RobAbility, I am not trying to mock you, just trying to take you statements seriously and what it implies.

    When you say that there is secret codes in one of the English versions of the Bible, does that mean that there also are secret codes in other languages like the French, Dutch, German or Swedish versions of the Bible? If that is so, as you can understand, we would surely be interested in knowing these hidden messages.

    Does that also mean that the translators, like Martin Luther and Olaus Petri, had divine inspiration? Should we worship them as Saints or may as Prophets?

    If the secret code are only hidden in the English language, does that mean that when the Bible was written 2500 years ago (Old Testament) and 1900 years ago (New Testament) that they then could foretell (by Divine Inspiration I guess) that more than 1000 years later there would come an English language into existence? It seems surprising that someone in the Middle east would write codes in a non-existing language in a distant foggy island out in the Atlantic ocean.

    Does that mean that the English language is a holy language? There are more than 6000 languages in the world. To pick one language, one out of 6000, 1/6000, seems to be highly significant (p-value <0.05). So, can I thereby conclude that there is something special with the English language, that it is a holy language?

    Ooooooh, I am writing in a holy language! I usually ask my reader to apologize me for my errors in English! Maybe I should also ask the Good God for forgiveness?

    I am sure that these questions have asked you many times before and that you have good answers to them.

    I am just trying to understand the implications of your statements. Maybe you can answer Dasons and my questions?

    - - -

    Meanwhile, maybe the rest of us can have a discussion about the problem when a hypothesis is suggested by the data. A quite common problem I believe. If you really believe in something very strong, like a special scientific school, then it is easy to search for evidence that support your beliefs.

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    Re: Probability of coincidence ?

    I asking where to start or how to start arranging a logical ordering of the data at hand that is to be used to determine the probabilities involved in determining the validity of hidden encoded information.

    In short...is the encoded data merely coincidental, or not? The hidden encoded data is found within the KJV Bible. Here are a few examples.

    If you look for the words "The Father" in the new testament, in code form it responds with the word "God".
    If you look for the words "The Lord" in the new testament, in code form it responds with the word "Christ".
    If you look for the words "The Father", "The Son", & "The Holy Spirit" in the new testament, in code form it responds with the words "God" & "Christ".
    If you look for the words "Mark" "of God" in the new testament, in code form it responds with the words "Christ" & "The One God".

    To me this defies mere coincidence. But again, I basically don't know where to start to perform a proper probability analysis of such a phenomena.

    To begin, when dealing with code numbers, there is a restriction to a limited set of numbers, those being 156, 444, 462, and 906. That narrows the field.

    These numbers represent names, and visa versa.
    Etc. 156 = God, 444 = Jesus, 462 = Christ, and 906 = Jesus Christ.

    As far as the rest goes, there is also an extreme word restriction. It is limited to....
    "Jesus", "Christ", "Prophet", "Messiah", "and God", "God and", plus "aka the".

    Thus overall, when appropriate responses pop up after a code search is performed, and they do, it does seem to be rather surprising at the very least.

    To get a view of the decoding at work, thus have access to the details, see http://www.outersecrets.com/real/biblecode2a.htm and click on "WATCH / LISTEN " to begin an automatic web page scrolling along with a complete audio coverage.



    How does one start a proper probability analysis of this particular code language phenomena.
    I am not interested in the specific thinking that when on in the mind that created the code language to thus create a language of a specific form, nor am I interested in the choice of its location nor the language that it was encoded in.

    I am however looking for the probability of the outcome of the use of this specific language being the real deal or not.

    Note: If you have questions concerning the codes language itself, its specific location, the language that it was encoded within, etc., etc., etc., please contact the creator of the code language, if you manage to find out who that is, since this will be the only source of appropriate answers.

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    Re: Probability of coincidence ?

    Quote Originally Posted by RobAbility View Post
    I am not interested in the specific thinking that when on in the mind that created the code language to thus create a language of a specific form, nor am I interested in the choice of its location nor the language that it was encoded in.

    I am however looking for the probability of the outcome of the use of this specific language being the real deal or not.

    Note: If you have questions concerning the codes language itself, its specific location, the language that it was encoded within, etc., etc., etc., please contact the creator of the code language, if you manage to find out who that is, since this will be the only source of appropriate answers.
    Sense, reason and intellect.

    You see, the problem with this is, that to evaluate the likelihood of whether it is the real deal or not, one cannot ignore everything that may point towards it being nonesense. That is exactly what people (Dason and Greta foremost among them) have been pointing out to you from the start. You need to answer such questions, as both Dason, spunky and Greta have asked, in an intelligent fashion, before we can make sense of what you are claiming.

    To evaluate whether your code is the real deal you need to start rationally considering all aspects, if you can defend your code rationally on multiple levels, then you will start convincing others that you have the real deal. Avoiding such questions does not improve a rational discourse. My sentiment about ignoring all evidence against your ideas was coined by Galileo 400 years ago:

    "I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."

    Galileo Galilei 1564 – 1642

    Which is why such endeavors, as many a Bible code, ultimately hurt the faith far more than it can ever help.
    Last edited by TheEcologist; 02-27-2014 at 04:55 PM.
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    Re: Probability of coincidence ?

    Quote Originally Posted by RobAbility View Post
    Years later I went back to my analysis of motion. Soon I had figured out what was really going on. Next I turned my understanding into a geometric representation and then used the geometric representation to convert my understanding into equations. I then borrowed a physics book and was tickled pink to find out that my equations were identical to those known today as the Lorentz-Fitzgerald Contraction equation, the Time Dilation equation, the Lorentz Transformation equations, and the Velocity Addition equation.

    By analyzing absolute motion present within an absolute Space-Time continuum, I ended up with a relativistic outcome which is the same as that known as Einstein's theory of Special Relativity, and at the same time was obviously revealing the absolute foundation that had created the relativistic outcome.

    Meanwhile my science teacher thought of me as nothing but an idiot because I did not see things the same way as others in general do.
    I am really fascinated in your theories and the way you derived them. Could you please elaborate on how you felt about the concept of motion, being something special, and that what did you tell your teacher, etc. (I am asking out of personal curiosity).

    Did you imagine the concept of motion or just tried to formulate your observations? I am asking this because the special relativity appears at speeds only close to the light speed, so I am not sure someone can recognize a pattern by mere observation of the moving macroscopic objects, and am extremely curious about the process (if you don't mind).

    Also could you please clarify the terms "absolute motion" and "absolute time-space continuum"? I wonder how did you analyze the absolute motion within the absolute time-space continuum?
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    Re: Probability of coincidence ?

    Quote Originally Posted by victorxstc View Post
    I enjoyed this thread and this particular post. I wish you the best in your quest. However, I have read somewhere that perhaps Bible is edited, completely burned, and perhaps rewritten from the scratch by the church. Therefore, as hlsmith stated, I am not sure if there really exists a code in it, or if it does, whether it is divine.

    I am really fascinated in your theories and the way you derived them. Could you please elaborate on how you felt about the concept of motion, being something special, and that what did you tell your teacher, etc. (I am asking out of personal curiosity).

    Did you imagine the concept of motion or just tried to formulate your observations? I am asking this because the special relativity appears at speeds only close to the light speed, so I am not sure someone can recognize a pattern by mere observation of the moving macroscopic objects, and am extremely curious about the process (if you don't mind).

    Also could you please clarify the terms "absolute motion" and "absolute time-space continuum"? I wonder how did you analyze the absolute motion within the absolute time-space continuum?
    Thanks for asking the question.

    I may as well switch topics anyhow, since most of the responses that I have received so far concerning the Bible Codes are absolutely outlandish.

    They seem to think that if one discovers Bible Codes, or better yet let's say discovered a tin full of gold coins in their back yard, they think that the one that discovered the tin full of gold coins should also be able to know absolutely everything about those coins, their shape, their origin, their reason for being buried, etc., and thus can and should be able to answer any and all possible questions about them.

    Where on earth do they come up with that kind of an idea ????????
    Where is the connection ?????????



    But moving on.

    It all goes back to the time that I noticed that moving at infinite speed across an infinite distance leads to the paradox of "Going on forever in no time at all.". This did not go well with the science teacher when I was making a point of it.

    Concerning absolute motion in an absolute Space-Time continuum, I was simply looking at reality from ground zero. By this I mean that whatever there is that exists, it is supported by a sound foundation at some point, thus it is supported eventually by an absolute foundation.

    Thus I started at that sound foundation when analizing motion.

    But to get to all the details, you would have to watch my video collection that is located at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KKAwp...vFbeBh-Mq7HdoQ otherwise, it would take what seems like forever when attempting to explain it here in bits and peices.

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    Re: Probability of coincidence ?

    Quote Originally Posted by RobAbility View Post
    They seem to think that if one discovers Bible Codes, or better yet let's say discovered a tin full of gold coins in their back yard, they think that the one that discovered the tin full of gold coins should also be able to know absolutely everything about those coins, their shape, their origin, their reason for being buried, etc., and thus can and should be able to answer any and all possible questions about them.

    Where on earth do they come up with that kind of an idea ????????
    Where is the connection ?????????
    The questions I asked, as I mentioned previously, are connected to a statistical analysis that could be done. You've fully admitted to not understanding the statistics so who are you to say that the questions I'm asking aren't relevant? They are completely relevant.

    Your analogy doesn't work at all by the way. Finding gold isn't the same thing as asking what the probability that gold was buried in your yard is.
    I don't have emotions and sometimes that makes me very sad.

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    Re: Probability of coincidence ?

    The only different position that me and the rest of you are in is that I discovered the codes. Therefore in no way do I have any answers to any questions that you do not.

    FOR GOD ALL MIGHTY BLOODY SAKE, this fact can not be any clearer than that.

    Just curiously I ask the question....Have yet driven someone to death?

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    Re: Probability of coincidence ?

    Quote Originally Posted by RobAbility View Post
    Just curiously I ask the question....Have yet driven someone to death?
    That's not really a question that makes sense. Fine - you don't have the answers to the questions I asked. Do you not see how they could be relevant though? Once again the Texas sharpshooter fallacy is highly relevant.

    I also see you've avoided the question of how the code you're talking about is different than the code in the link Lazar provided.
    I don't have emotions and sometimes that makes me very sad.

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    Re: Probability of coincidence ?

    Or better yet let's say someone claims to have discovered a tin full of gold coins in their back yard, just claims it - and avoids anyones questions to the authenticity of his outlandish claim and can't even answer simple question like their shape, their appearance, color, why he dug for the tin can in the first place reason - questions anybody who dug up a tin can out of his yard should reasonably have thought about. But he expects everybody just to accept the that there is gold in the tin can and not, say, someones dead pet.

    Anyway, this guy didn't invent anything special, as his code is basically a combination of already heavily flawed gematria and skip codes.


    Skip codes are where you select a text and an initial point, and then pick every Nth letter (see ELS in the link). The resulting letters are bound together with selected the word boundaries. The “codes” discovered by this are mostly nonsense but you can sieve through the sequences until you get something that makes sense to you ... cherry picking your way ( as OP says "when appropriate responses pop up") until you discover those diamonds in the mountainous dung hill of nonsense.

    Gematria is an Assyro-Babylonian system of numerology later adopted by Jews. So it's a system from heathen gods which makes this even funnier. Anyway, it assigns a numerical value to a word or phrases. One example of Gematria is the Hebrew word Chai ("alive"), which is composed of two letters which add up to 18 (see link) - hence 18 is a "lucky number" among Jews. So it basically means that every word can be interpreted as a number, and many numbers can be interpreted as words. Over the years many mystics became fascinated with codes in the Torah by converting back and forth between letters and numbers.
    In more modern times, tons of crackpots have read about gematria. The problem however is that instead of learning Hebrew, and sticking to the original system, they dream up numerical mappings for English letters, and then do it in English.

    So our friends genius was to combine the two, hopelessly flawed methods, the "dunghill diamond mining" and the "lost in translation" method, into a system which eventually leads (if you follow the link to his website) to a "Sean Proudler" in being a profet. Which I can only assume is OP, as my trace of the website email address location came up pretty close to the OP location. Thing is we can use the same algorithm to prove that Peter Falk was the one true profet, or trinker.. or this guy for all I care.

    I think I can end with this:

    "Most people are not natural-born statisticians. Left to our own devices
    we are not very good at picking out patterns from a sea of noisy data. To put it
    another way, we are all too good at picking out non existing patterns that happen
    to suit our purposes.”

    Efron and Tibshirani. (1993)

    And OP's purpose is apparently to prove that "Sean Proudler" is a profet.
    Last edited by TheEcologist; 02-27-2014 at 07:19 PM.
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    Re: Probability of coincidence ?

    KIDS.......Oy vey.

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    Re: Probability of coincidence ?


    Quote Originally Posted by RobAbility View Post
    KIDS.......Oy vey.
    I agree.

    http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/crackpot.html

    I think it's about time we bring a close to this show.

    RobAbility - if you feel like you've thought it over and will actually cooperate when we ask questions feel free to send me a PM and we can see if we can get this thread opened again.
    Last edited by Dason; 02-27-2014 at 09:32 PM.
    I don't have emotions and sometimes that makes me very sad.

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